update fees

[affidavit]

how can a free for life, legally be a must pay for latest version software ? Donation request ok but you must pay breaks the contract of past users whom purchased upgrades are free !

[rusticdog]

Hi there

As per this thread I've tried to answer the common questions.
http://forum.firetrust.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=6550

[affidavit]

you gave your reply thats true but it does not change updates are free for life and now it's $10 a year. New version - update -- same thing.http://forum.firetrust.com/posting.php? ... b91d122109#

[oldfart]

"Quote"
What does the renewal fee cover
Updates, bug fixes, support, and the subscription for FirstAlert. We will also do our best to offer up extras as best we can, the most obvious extra that's high on our list would be a portable version that could run from a USB stick.


"Quote"
You guys are just a bunch of thieving scumbags!
We aren't trying to shaft users, we're trying to forge a path for the future. That starts with the reworked MailWasher. You might disagree, and that's fine as we know it won't be for everyone, but there is no intention at all to remove MailWasher 6.x from the website.

"Quote"
We are however drawing a line where a persons expectations on improving the software is balanced against the costs associated. The onus is on us to front up and deliver with things that truly add value, if we don't you won't renew and we'll lose a customer and that would make us sad.




I don't agree with most of what you say the renewal fee covers, First bug fixes, why should we have to pay for bug fixes, end users expect to have bought a program that doesn't have/almost any bugs in it and if they do expect them to be fixed free, also support should be free for the first year and if needed after that a payment is ok, and first alert should be optional I don't use it or need it I decide if something is not what I want and is why I bought mailwasher for in the first place.

The attitude that firetrust has taken, take it or go back to the old version, realy sucks, and for me will be the last cent that firetrust gets from me, and if I don't find an alternitive, I will just go back to my old versionthat I bought a licence for just like this new version.
You can draw a line where ever you like but, your bread and butter may not like that line and go feed someone else that doesn't expect to be paid every year, for something that they might not want or need as far as upgrades or improvements that you think would justify the subscription for, I know that users place suggestions for features and other ideas, that is great but for us that are happy with what they have it isn't great, we may not want or need more features and things added on, wouldn't it be better if the new features or add on's be charged for if they were wanted, rather force customers to pay a yearly subscription, just because some people think something would be good to have in the program and you may think it would be as well, doesn't justify the cost to all that may or may not want it but have to pay in any case.
Let people pay for upgrades if they want it, sure the new mailwasher looks good but I still use it the way I used the older version and wished that I knew that it was going to be a yearly subscription I would have not upgraded it from the email I got that didn't mention anything about the subscription plan, and don't say anything about reading the licence agreement in the new version as I, like most, would have just trusted that it would be as per the agreement of the old one, if firetrust wants to use that as en excuse that we should have read it, I would have thought that they would have made a important note in their email about the new version, instaed of hiding it in some other pages, even on the download link where we download it, have it mentioned there that it has changed to a yearly subscription.
If you offer a refund I will except it, but I don't think that will ever happen.
Regards
oldfart.

[rusticdog]

I already offered you a refund, you didn't reply.

[oldfart]

I haven't recieved the offer yet but I will except it.
regards
oldfart.

[rusticdog]

I haven't recieved the offer yet but I will except it.
regards
oldfart.

Please refer to your original post http://forum.firetrust.com/viewtopic.ph ... =60#p36866

I've done this for you anyway now, it will take a few days most likely, but you'll get email updates as it processes.

[mcullet]

how can a free for life, legally be a must pay for latest version software ? Donation request ok but you must pay breaks the contract of past users whom purchased upgrades are free !

This quote goes straight to the pool room! (RD - we need a pool room

Please - everyone, before bothering to post ill considered comments like this, take some time and read the EULA (end user licence agreement) for MWP and all software. The agreement provides all of the answers to most of the ill formed questions, comments and opinions.

BTW - none of us own this software - we purchased a user licence. Somehow some people seem to gloss over this little bit of reality - gets in the way of a good rant.

"Free for life" - means what exactly? At best it's an expression of good will. In reality it is meaningless for several reasons. Firetrust is not a charity and those who work for the company are not like some fairy tale characters who toil all night so that a product is produced when Nick Bolton et al wakes up in the morning. Any person who is too lousy to pay for continued use of a product deserves precisely what they pay for - and not one thing more. As in: the ORIGINAL version of the product that existed when you paid for the licence plus any non-major upgrades at the sole discretion of the developer: online support in keeping with the price you paid (read - wait and wait and wait), no ongoing access to this website, not one thing more than the licence to use a specific version of the software.

Secondly - what do you get when Firetrust goes broke? Answer - what you deserve. All EULA's contain words that resolve to this: "Use at your own risk. If it works, great, if not - bummer. We reserve the right to change things at our sole discretion". The latter words mean - reality: things change / prices change / policies change / technology changes. Don't take my word for it - read every EULA for software licences that you purchased - they are pretty much the same. Now if you did not read it - not my problem. If you read it but chose not to ask questions - not my problem. BTW - we are not talking about the purchase of a new Mercedes here ... we are pissing about over a few dollars ($10) for a brand new product.

@ Old Fart - you do like to write rubbish. Pity none of it is accurate or reasonable (or intelligible in parts). This behavior is called trolling. Saddest thing from my perspective is that you get your money back and we end up carrying you. Great - not.

This is my personal opinion - MWP2010 is actually a completely new product (written from the ground up in .Net code) and Firetrust could easily have presented it as such, called it SPAMGO (whatever) so that there was no confusion that it really is a new product and then charged a fair market price for it. They did not do so - their decision. They could have retired the old version of MWP but chose NOT to because despite claims to the contrary, the company is ethical and most keen to help it's millions of customers subject to the realities of resource constraints. Translation: they are being generous. IMHO - it will not be feasible to support two different versions of MWP because of costs and technology changes. So, enjoy the free ride on MWP 6.x while you can. There are no valid commercial reasons for Firetrust to devote resources into maintaining a dead product.

Firetrust and Firetrust alone are the only entity entitled to make business decisions about product development, marketing and pricing. Customers do have some say - but ultimately their 'say' is expressed in terms of whether or not to buy. All else is considered feedback - often essential, always non binding, sometimes helpful - but feedback.

Not one of you has actually argued why those of us (like me) who are willing and happy to pay a fair price for MWP2010 should subsidise those (like you lot) who are too lousy to shell out anything towards maintaining product support and development. I have no interest in the least of carrying bludgers. And yet, based upon your comments, that is what you expect me (and all fee paying customers) to do. Why should we - what's in it for me?

However, I have backed Firetrust since Nick Bolton developed MWP and will back his decisions and ethical choices - even if I don't happen to like carrying parasites - because I can see ahead and I'm NOT lousy. No Firetrust - spammers jump for joy. My backing is not based upon Nick Bolton - never met him, but on what I know is a brilliant product that rocks spammers for six. If it did not work, then I'd try to help make it better (somehow) or find something else that did what I need.

Do you really think bug fixes appear out of thin air? Did you think a tiny income stream could possibly cover the real cost of things like this forum (upon which you happily pontificate inaccurate puerile comments - from your lips to God's ears)?

$10? There's must have been a terrible worldwide financial crisis when such a piddling amount of money is whined about so passionately (and pointlessly). I can buy a cup and a half of coffee, OR one McDonald burger and a small drink, OR two cans of soft drink OR two meat pies (no sauce). (Can't watch a movie in a theatre but might be able to rent one on a cheap night.) And once these SINGLE things are consumed, I have shell out more to keep alive. What? Shock horror!!

It is called life - deal with it.

If you cannot afford the $10 licence fee ($0.03 / day for MWP2010) then you sure as hell cannot afford to use the internet so i guess, for you the product would be pointless. $10??? With $10 of petrol, I can just make it to the shop - but not back! Some of you poor souls must really be doing it tough if $0.03 cents/ day is what it takes to push you into the poor house. It's clearly sent some of you on a rant.

Maybe instead of suggesting Firetrust operate on a donation basis (unbelievably dumb idea), we should ask Firetrust to set up a donation process to support you poor, hard-done-by unhappy people. Don't hold your breath waiting for me to contribute

RD said this best:

Why are you charging for this new version?
MailWasher has been going for 9 years and we've never asked for an upgrade fee for new versions, they've always been supplied free of charge. As you might appreciate, over time this strategy, while popular with users, meant we couldn't throw as many resources at it as we would have liked.

MailWasher was never designed to be the program it became and over time as more features were added it became more difficult to work on, even small bug fixes were taking longer to resolve and sometimes even brought more problems in. Whilst we could have chosen to rewrite aspects of MailWasher using the same technologies, that would not have improved the situation.

We can see the effect that the one off purchase model has had in MailWasher 6.x and earlier, for essentially the last 4 years we did nothing but try to fight bugs, there was no innovation, and little improvement overall to the program. As the saying goes, you can't polish a turd but you can roll it in glitter.

[affidavit]

Mike - your point well stated, you think that those who do not think like you are wrong which you could have said in 1 very short sentence . But you still did not address the issue of when ones word is given if not kept than how can it be trusted after that. I was taught that your word is your bond. And I also have been with Nick from the beginning and would repurchase a license but not with a mandatory yearly fee. And finally when you degrade people like you have done you become irrelevant so make your point without showing your stupidity!!!!!!

[rusticdog]

I think we can safely close this topic now.

[mcullet]

I think we can safely close this topic now.

Sigh ... totally agree. Let's lock this puppy down. Sometimes there are situations where no matter what is said or done, people can't (won't?) find common ground. This issue (in various threads) goes nowhere and is boring.

As a suggestion, since your the forum moderator, would it be unreasonable to hive off (move / quarantine) similar future posts under a single clearly marked thread? That way those who want to, can have at each other as much as they want. But I want no part in any such discussions. It's wasting my time. Equally as important, I don't want to upset anyone nor be upset by others - which seems to me to be all that this issue (in it's various forms) achieves.

I'm far more interested in dealing with genuine tech issues. Before anyone objects, we all have a perfect right to determine how to best use our time. I choose to use mine to help people who have legitimate tech problems. It's fun, I learn heaps and maybe some of my minor efforts might contribute towards making MWP2010 better.

[rusticdog]

The locked posts will disappear far down the list in time. As as aside I actually forgot to lock this didn't I